Obama sucks

[x[bodyshot]]

This is what I really dislike, playing class warfare and bait and switch tactics with hidden agenda.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100114/...ma_bank_fees_9

Obama's Words:
-He described bank bonuses as "obscene" and called for a new tax on Wall Street's largest firms to cover a projected $117 billion shortfall in the government's financial crisis bailout fund.
-"My determination to achieve this goal is only heightened when I see reports of massive profits and obscene bonuses at the very firms who owe their continued existence to the American people who have not been made whole, and who continue to face real hardship in this recession,"

Suggested Tax:
-He is proposing a levy of 15 basis points, or 0.15 percent, on the liabilities of large financial institutions. The tax, which officials are calling a "financial crisis responsibility fee," would apply only to financial companies with assets of more than $50 billion. Those firms — estimated to amount to about 50 institutions

Reality of Tax:
- All Companies would have to pay the fee even though many did not accept any taxpayer assistance and most others already paid back the government lent to them.
- General Motors Co. and Chrysler Group LLC, whose $66 billion in government loans are not expected to be fully repaid, would not be subject to a tax.
- The official said that if the shortfall was eliminated within a decade, the tax would still remain in place for the full 10-year minimum.

Money Quote:
- "This is a punitive tax on companies that repaid TARP in full or never took TARP."

My Opinion:
- He is throwing class warfare into the discussion talking about "bonuses" when that has nothing to do with the legislation.
- The stated goal is to recoup losses from companies that "owe their existence to bailout"
------ 1) Why does this not only apply to those companies that took money? (It just looks like a tax on the companies he thinks can pay it)
------ 2) Why would it remain in existence after the money is payed back?
- This is how redistribution gets out of control. Shell out huge gobs of money to those who need it, when that money runs out tax people still making money, when that money runs out do the same.

This is a pretty clear case of socialism and wealth distribution, trying to bait and switch on what is really being taxed and why.

[x[killdozer]]

-- The reason noone is complaining is because it's spending for a reason this time. It's to stimulate the economy by improving infrastructure. Same thing worked during war time.

Bullshit. My mom worked, keyword worked, for the two largest formliner companies on the west coast, and one of the largest in the country. Even after the stimulus money was out, jobs where they won the bids were canceled and there weren't any new projects. Every construction job that involves poured concrete needs formliners...that's just about all of them.

--Actually this is going to create millions of jobs in America and pave the way for the future of renewable energy while cleaning up the worst polluters. http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/...310_825431.htm I'm sorry if your motivation for not liking this is because you think global warming is not real, but it is.

I don't know where you got the global warming thing because I never mentioned it. The fact is this bill will make energy more expensive in this country, and hence everything made and done in this country will be more expensive. That's fucking retarded.

-- I'm not a huge fan of the way that went down either, but the fact is that the economy would have taken a huge shit if they failed. We'd all be hurting for a long time (probably better long term), but short term it would be very painful.

Bottom line we're still fucked, taxpayers are still on the hook, and the crooks and government cronies got away with it again. G fucking G.

-- Dunno what to say there as I'm not sure what the situation is.

It's fucked and that brain dead cunt doesn't know what the fuck she's doing in that position.

-- Yeah that is one of my biggest beefs tbh.

Where's all the pissy energy the democrats and liberals had when Bush and Cheny were in office. Where are the mass riots? Where's the civil unrest? Oh yeah, he's your boy...so it's coo.

--not directly his fault, but i see your point. i know he said he would, maybe its a priority issue.

Dems and libs were going fucking nuts about this shit while Bush was in office. You'd think it would at least be on the agenda if they gave a shit. Here's a hint, all those people in office DON'T CARE.


-- what would you suggest he do?

Call a spade a spade. Don't be hampered by political correctness. Janet Napolitano and her "man made disasters" need to be given the boot and there needs to be a real hardass in her spot. Even Bush didn't do to well on this one because of the PC nonsense, but honestly that shit needs to go away.

1. How long it takes to get anything changed once the need is seen.

Eight Years under Bush, plus two years campaigning up to 2008. The entire political machine is behind him, there's nothing stopping him except that he doesn't want to. He's a liar and a phony.

2. Looking farther out than this year or next. Understanding the consequences of what we do now and how that affects what our kids are around to deal with.

IMHO they've mostly made the wrong decisions with the wrong long term affects. They just don't fucking care. The laws they write and the rules they live in don't apply to them. It's all about pandering to votes. Who cares about the long term affects when you live in a bubble. They just want to stay in power.

More things to get pissed about:

Cybersecurity Act of 2009

Campaigning for more transparency in government and totally failing to actually do anything to improve it.

Obama going along with the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement and not making any of the information or proceedings public.

Latest development in the health care clusterfuck:

In a significant victory for unions, the 40 percent excise tax would not apply to policies covering workers in collective bargaining agreements, state and local workers and members of voluntary employee benefit associations through Dec. 31, 2017.

So the people in the private sector have to pay the excise tax while equivalent plans in the public sector don't get taxed. Typical big government bullshit. Protect their own and fuck everyone else. It's these huge public employee health plan entitlements that are choking California. Now after a record tax increase earlier this year, we get to look forward to another huge tax increase to cover the twenty something billion dollar defect CA has. The same shit is happening on a federal level and it's not sustainable. These next few years will bankrupt the country.

[x[method]]

Bullshit. My mom worked, keyword worked, for the two largest formliner companies on the west coast, and one of the largest in the country. Even after the stimulus money was out, jobs where they won the bids were canceled and there weren't any new projects. Every construction job that involves poured concrete needs formliners...that's just about all of them.

-- This sounds like a real estate issue... which is another ball of wax entirely. Either way, while that sucks for your mom, it's not indicative of the state of the rest of the economy. We should have had a depressionesque decline, but instead for most it's just a moderate change.

I don't know where you got the global warming thing because I never mentioned it. The fact is this bill will make energy more expensive in this country, and hence everything made and done in this country will be more expensive. That's fucking retarded. .

-- So anything that makes you pay more now than previously is "fucking retarded"? Even if it improves national security and paves the way for energy independence & gets the green energy ball rolling? I'm sorry, but that's just a straight up short sided viewpoint and is the main thing that drives me insane about republicans. You just can't see farther than your account balance and THAT is fucking retarded my friend.

Where's all the pissy energy the democrats and liberals had when Bush and Cheny were in office. Where are the mass riots? Where's the civil unrest? Oh yeah, he's your boy...so it's coo.

-- This isn't a purposeful undoing of civil liberties. This is a failure to clean up someone else's mess. It's unfortunate you can't see the difference.

Latest development in the health care clusterfuck:
So the people in the private sector have to pay the excise tax while equivalent plans in the public sector don't get taxed. Typical big government bullshit. Protect their own and fuck everyone else. It's these huge public employee health plan entitlements that are choking California. Now after a record tax increase earlier this year, we get to look forward to another huge tax increase to cover the twenty something billion dollar defect CA has. The same shit is happening on a federal level and it's not sustainable. These next few years will bankrupt the country.

-- So let me get this straight. Public health plans are choking california? So you would rather people be tossed out on the street or not get any care at all? Most in that situation will simply die or just not get care, which I guess is OK with you, but what heppens when they get desperate? Inability to receive basic social services is what pushes people to do stupid things in order to take care of themselves. If you can't see the effect that has on the rest of society (including yourself...)... then you simply don't understand what these programs are for. I live in a place with free education and free healthcare. People make far less on average than they do in America (due to a 50% tax), but they are on average FAR happier. They have no obesity problems, no crime problems, not even a drug problem here. It would take me 2 hours of writing to describe exactly why that is, but just know that it is that way because they invested in their future by providing education and basic social services for the people.

[x[killdozer]]

-- This sounds like a real estate issue... which is another ball of wax entirely. Either way, while that sucks for your mom, it's not indicative of the state of the rest of the economy. We should have had a depressionesque decline, but instead for most it's just a moderate change.

It's not a real estate issue. These were jobs from CalTrans and just about every states department of transportation from CA to Illinois. The stimulus money for real infrastructure jobs never got there.

-- So anything that makes you pay more now than previously is "fucking retarded"? Even if it improves national security and paves the way for energy independence & gets the green energy ball rolling? I'm sorry, but that's just a straight up short sided viewpoint and is the main thing that drives me insane about republicans. You just can't see farther than your account balance and THAT is fucking retarded my friend.

Anything that makes energy more expensive during a recession when the economy is trying to get back on its feet and people are struggling to pay bills IS FUCKING RETARDED. I'm all for national security and energy independence: Nuclear power now, and maybe in 50 years solar or something else will be more feasible. Right now, the tech isn't there, and it won't be there for a few more decades. I agree that we should close down all our fossil fuel burning power plants, but green tech isn't going to make up the energy we need right now. Nuclear is our stopgap, develop green energy from now until the plants get long in the tooth (or we run out of stockpiled nuclear fuel) and decommission them. Doing this now is really, really, really bad timing.


-- This isn't a purposeful undoing of civil liberties. This is a failure to clean up someone else's mess. It's unfortunate you can't see the difference.

So bitch about it for 8 years, and then when you have the deck stacked in your favor you don't do anything. That's called being spineless.


-- Big I don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

You don't understand what I said. CA unions don't have to pay for their health care. Not a single cent. They probably have better health care than I do. I have to pay for my health care, and I have to pay my ungodly taxes to support their health care plans. Why can't they pay into their own system? Why does the taxpayer, some of them who don't have health insurance, have to pay for the crazy plans the Union members get for free? That's bullshit. It's a one way street and the unions are getting all the political favors while your average slob has to pay out the nose. We need an even playing field, and the Great Obama Health Care Plan was supposed to do that, and he lied. Everyone should be treated equal with universal health care. That deal was a fucking disgrace and I hope it gets challenged in court.

[x[method]]

What is unclear about the last passage? It's not exactly an obtuse concept. Am I not explaining it clearly?

[x[bodyshot]]

You didn't even want to address my post on his tax? Obama is being that indefensible?

[x[method]]

i'm not going to defend what they are doing in response to the financial crisis. It's too little too late. That being said I think you're reading a little too much into this as a conspiracy theory =P

[x[killdozer]]

What is unclear about the last passage? It's not exactly an obtuse concept. Am I not explaining it clearly?

I understood what you typed. I brushed it off because it was completely off topic.

-- So let me get this straight. Public health plans are choking california? So you would rather people be tossed out on the street or not get any care at all? Most in that situation will simply die or just not get care, which I guess is OK with you, but what heppens when they get desperate? Inability to receive basic social services is what pushes people to do stupid things in order to take care of themselves. If you can't see the effect that has on the rest of society (including yourself...)... then you simply don't understand what these programs are for. I live in a place with free education and free healthcare. People make far less on average than they do in America (due to a 50% tax), but they are on average FAR happier. They have no obesity problems, no crime problems, not even a drug problem here. It would take me 2 hours of writing to describe exactly why that is, but just know that it is that way because they invested in their future by providing education and basic social services for the people.

You missed what I'm talking about. I'm not talking about public health plans. I'm talking about the sweetheart Cadallac plans the employess of California (and other state) unions don't have to pay for and now won't get taxed for them either. These obtuse health plans the union members don't pay into are chocking the budgets of California and other states. The burden of payment is on the poor slob taxpayer who can't really afford health insurance, and if they're lucky are paying for their own coverage, and now they'll be taxed for it too. It's an uneven playing field that's being bought out by political favors and backdoor deals.

Obama didn't bring hope or change. It's just the same shit from a new set of assholes.

[x[killdozer]]

So I guess we're done here?

[x[method]]

I was looking for clear arguments about Obama and to some extent I got them, but for the most part it seems like mostly you're are just sick of the same old shit (as am I). If Obama can't bring change, then I'm pretty damn sure noone can. It's going to take a new kind of revolution to change things and I have some ideas about how that can happen, but I don't want to get too far off topic from this thread so I'll keep it at that.

[x[lonedub]]

i was looking for clear arguments about obama and to some extent i got them, but for the most part it seems like mostly you're are just sick of the same old shit (as am i). If obama can't bring change, then i'm pretty damn sure noone can. It's going to take a new kind of revolution to change things and i have some ideas about how that can happen, but i don't want to get too far off topic from this thread so i'll keep it at that.

new thread new thread new thread!

[Kaj]

Obama sucks!! SO yeah he gets the nobel pease prize for sucking.!

[Kaj]

Wow Method that is serious shit coming from you. My God I think you have the gear to pack in my beloved Corp! Thank you for saying Obama sucks! lol

[x[method]]

That was originally intended as sarcasm, however its been so long since I posted this that I really do now believe that he's exactly the same as the rest of them. (see shredding of the constitution). http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...=FBCNETTXT9038

[x[method]]

new thread new thread new thread!

Alrighty

[x[killdozer]]

As stated before:
Eight years of bitching, protest, congressional investigations, and lawsuits under Bush.
Obama makes it legal...and nothing.

Eat shit America. You deserve it.

[_elilia]

You the talented person

[x[bled]]

Lol... I forgot about this thread. His ideas sure pulled us out of our economic problems. Yay.

[x[bodyshot]]

Hahaha, so did I... its trippy... like a little time capsule...